• @sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works
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    1 month ago

    Yeah, that’s weird.

    The reason iPhones are impractical to make in the US has nothing to do with anatomy or genetics, it’s purely labor costs. You can hire someone to work for very little and for very long in China, you can’t do that in the US. That’s it. That’s the only reason.

    • Ogmios
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      1 month ago

      hire

      They’ve been known to literally lock people in their factories, and even put up suicide nets to prevent slaves from killing themselves.

      • Doom
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        221 month ago

        Iqbal Masih

        Google this boy if you haven’t heard of him everyone. Two adult men assassinated a child for what he had to say

        • Match!!
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          21 month ago

          This is the darkest thing I’ve seen today, thanks

    • @jonathan@lemmy.zip
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      361 month ago

      That’s it. That’s the only reason.

      Manufacturing labour costs are far cheaper outside of China but the skills aren’t available. While labour costs are always a factor, the US just doesn’t have enough skilled manufacturing engineers or the supply chain you get somewhere like Shenzen.

      • Ulrich
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        91 month ago

        the US just doesn’t have enough skilled manufacturing engineers or the supply chain

        That’s because it was all outsourced to China because they utilize cheap/free labor.

        If we had started doing tariffs 30 years ago we could have prevented that. Or if we enacted tariffs as part of a larger plan to slowly transition that industry back over the next 20 years, we could probably do that as well.

        But just slapping a 250% tariff overnight and expecting everything to sort itself out is the kind of a plan only the orange moron could come up with.

      • @sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works
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        61 month ago

        The US had and has plenty, which is why manufacturing started in the US and migrated out once processes standardized enough to bring in less competent labor. Then labor became more competent, so more companies moved their operations there. A lot of US manufacturing engineers work with Chinese manufacturing facilities, because that’s where the labor is.

        If the US wants to bring manufacturing back, it needs to be cheaper to do it domestically. That means automation, better materials transportation, and cheap raw materials.

        I don’t see the point. Instead of bringing back manufacturing, improve education and focus on higher value work.

    • sunzu2
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      81 month ago

      China ain’t the cheapest anymore and has not been for a while.

      • @sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works
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        31 month ago

        No, but it’s substantially cheaper than the US and cheap enough that moving operations isn’t practical. Companies are moving to other south Asian countries, but China remains a staple for reasonably competent and reasonably cheap labor.

        • @orclev@lemmy.world
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          61 month ago

          China also has an established, robust, and technically advanced manufacturing sector. That honestly is the biggest thing keeping manufacturing there. Things made from raw resources could be moved easily but the lower labor costs would be offset by the decreased demand due to most of their customers being back in China.

          Things are even worse for anyone making something that requires manufactured components as all those suppliers are in China so now not only are they taking a hit for reduced demand, but also the headaches of having to import their components from China just to build anything. Labor would need to be ridiculously cheap compared to China for that to start looking like a good idea.

          • @sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works
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            21 month ago

            China also has an established, robust, and technically advanced manufacturing sector

            So does the US, they just do a lot less manufacturing than they used to because it became cheaper to send that to other countries. The US does a lot more design work than actual production.

            Labor would need to be ridiculously cheap compared to China for that to start looking like a good idea.

            Right, which is why labor moved to China in the first place. If labor gets more expensive in China, manufacturing will move elsewhere, both for components and finished products.

            The only way to get large scale back to developed countries is through automation, which dramatically reduces the labor cost. But at that point, it’s not creating jobs anyway, so why not do that nearer to where the raw materials are extracted anyway?

            I personally don’t understand why developed countries are so interested in moving manufacturing back. I understand it’s not great for national security and whatnot, so it makes sense to have some domestic production capability if there’s ever war in the region, but a lot of that issue can be solved by diversifying where things are produced, since war is unlikely to impact the entire supply chain if you maintain naval dominance, which the US has and they share it w/ other developed western powers.

    • @iopq@lemmy.world
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      1 month ago

      Chinese wages are not actually that low. In Beijing minimum wage is ¥26.4 which is $3.66

      US federal minimum wage is $7.25

      • @sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works
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        41 month ago

        Yet for these types of jobs, nobody gets paid minimum wage, even $15/hr is probably low. What is the typical Chinese employee making for this type of work?

        • @iopq@lemmy.world
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          71 month ago

          Also several times the minimum wage. The minimum wage jobs are the do nothing jobs like door man.

          The fact is, the difference is in concentration. You have millions of workers in Shenzhen all in the same area doing similar jobs. It makes it easy to ask one factory to manufacture a thing and the one next door to assemble it.

    • @orclev@lemmy.world
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      31 month ago

      Well it’s also about supply chains. All the components are also made in China so you’d end up ordering the parts and then having to wait a month or more for them to be shipped to the US. If you want to avoid delays that means maintaining a significant stockpile of parts in the US that you may or may not ever actually use.

      • @sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works
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        11 month ago

        Sure, but I don’t think supply chains are the critical factor here. You don’t necessarily need local supply if you can break up delivery into small enough chunks, so whether it takes a day or a month to get a part isn’t important once the flow is going smoothly. You only need local supply if there’s a significant risk of disruption/delays.

        Yes, it’s probably a bit cheaper to assemble things closer to where they’re produced, but I still think labor costs are the determining factor. US workers expect higher pay, more PTO, less hours worked per week, and more benefits, so even if all the parts were shipped in perfectly consistently, it would still be significantly more expensive to assemble iPhones in the US vs in China.