- cross-posted to:
- comicstrips@lemmy.world
- cross-posted to:
- comicstrips@lemmy.world
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I’mma give this one to the lady on the bottom right. Not for the reason she states, but if you got 7 kids you gotta pile in, a Corolla ain’t gonna cut it.
A minivan will hold as many kids, is safer than an SUV, and they are on the smaller end of the SUV sizes.
I have a “midsize” SUV and went on vacation with seven people, and it could hardly hold all of us even with a luggage rack on the hitch. We rented a minivan at our destination, and it EASILY fit all seven people and luggage with room to spare and was more comfortable. It also was a hybrid and got > 30mpg. Definitely wanting to rethink that SUV purchase now.
I have a little Mitsubishi Outlander that seats 7 and I’d cut off a toe for a minivan.
My teenager has to crawl through the hatch to get in her seat lol.
I do think minivans should be more common as being more practical, but I don’t see how they’re safer. They also tend to be less fuel efficient due to aerodynamics. They tend to have a lower floor with more or less the same ceiling height. That gives them a larger frontal cross section compared to an equivalent sized SUV.
This applies to vans and trucks, as well. Trucks based on the same platform tend to have better mileage than the van.
They are safer to pedestrians because they tend to have lower and more curved hoods (making impact at low speeds less dangerous) and they also give better visibility to the driver.
Thank you. For some reason our entire society thinks “safety” only applies to the people inside of the vehicle.
It’s a testament to our very individualized society under capitalism. It’s basing all values on a individuals consumption choices. Rather than the safety and security of society as a whole.
Sadly, carrying around a brick above your head is still the only “consumer” choice pedestrians have for safety.
That last panel is why the entire “fuck cars” movement is a joke. You can’t have real solutions if you don’t have real empathy.
I don’t think you’ve spent much time here if you think that “fuck cars” is being said without empathy. None of us think that nobody should be allowed to own a car and that there aren’t legitimate use cases. Just that the vast majority of cases are Not That and for how dangerous and inefficient they are, along with infrastructure that only considers the experience of people in cars, the extent that cars have taken over and define our lives (again, as non-single-mothers-of-seven) is ridiculous.
Also, station wagons used to exist. Mini vans still exist. You could transport this many kids and not have to drive a massive truck that’s likely to mow one of them down in the driveway before you even notice they’re unaccounted for. There are other “real solutions” for this person. In fact, that single mother would have a far more peaceful time transporting her family if the cars around her were both smaller in size and fewer in number. Our interests are aligned, you see.
Have you tried having some empathy for those that are strained by the financial burden of owning a car? Society should consider people that don’t want and shouldn’t need to own a car just as much as it considers people who do need to own a car. Go project your lack of “real empathy” somewhere else cause it’s definitely misplaced here.
I mean here is a comparison between a minivan and a 3 row EV SUV:
https://www.carsized.com/en/cars/compare/honda-odyssey-2017-minivan-us-vs-kia-ev9-2023-suv/
Not every SUV is a Suburban or Escalade.
Also, a wagon is not a replacement for a Minivan, the station wagon jump seats that I grew up with were firmly in the crumple zone, and would prevent any cargo from being loaded.
The person who wrote this comic never shopped for a family hauler, or has shopped for a family hauler and ignored their lived experience to make a quip.
Here’s the thing: “Family-hauler” is so dumb. In a sane society, that wouldn’t even be a thing. Those kids should have the freedom to get around on their own, but they can’t because of all the super-sized “family-haulers” that would kill them.
I think the bottom right one is supposed to be sympathetic and more making fun of the catch 22 of the car arms race caused by all the other panels.
If that’s why the movement is a joke, then why are there several upvoted posts here saying that one is a legit reason?
Even if we outright banned cars with no nuance or forethought whatsoever, that would still save billions from climate change.
I’m now suddenly suspecting that 7 seater compact cars are not a thing in places like the US. We got 7 seater Avanzas here in the third world, but come to think of it, there might be some regulatory thing preventing this format of car from being sold in some places.
It’s good. We used taxis like that a lot in HS before anyone in the friend group was 18 (yes yes you let your kids drive at 16 in the US how open minded of you to create more car customers like that), it came out to very little per person when you had like 6-7 people sharing essentially one small economy car.
I think it wouldn’t be the most convenient since you can’t put much cargo with all the seats up, but like there are more formats out there right? First gen Honda Odyssey size is what I would have in mind - surely some manufacturer is still making something similar?
Tank-on-wheels is a ridiculous default design
A big part of it is the lack of sanely sized options, which is driven by a combination of confirmation bias (“the best sellers are all giant SUVs” when the only real options are giant SUVs), low gas prices, and incentives to manufacturers by classifying vehicles as trucks to get around emissions rules. We could undo a lot of it if we taxed and regulated giant SUVs and trucks the same way we do smaller cars, but that hits the profits of big auto and would be politically disadvantageous for anyone to try so they don’t.
^^This.
I would have much rather purchased an EV coupe. It’s useless for me to haul around 5 seats. I rarely have more than one ass in the car at a time.
lack of sanely sized options
I don’t get this, like they still make sedans. Go to a toyota or honda dealership and there are still plenty of small affordable efficient cars.
I agree we should definitely tax them but that’ll only go so far. Even if we tax them people have shown there willing to spend a lot more money for an suv . People view them as a status symbol and cultural signifier and will pay a lot since a part of there identity is based off it.
Strict regulation making it so a majority of people just can’t buy one would be the only way, but thats unpopular and fox News would have a field day about “the liberals are coming for your truck”
@Not_mikey @Wxfisch Go to a Toyota or Honda dealership and you’ll find that longstanding models like the Civic and Corolla are much larger and less affordable than they were at the peak of their popularity. Ford no longer makes sedans and GM makes few. All the car companies aggressively market trucks and SUVs to the exclusion of sedans and hatchbacks. That’s not because consumers decided they wanted “status symbols,” it’s because SUVs & trucks have higher profit margins.
@Not_mikey @Wxfisch I know unfortunately many people who own mid-sized SUVs. No one I choose to associate with has one a status symbol. They’re motivated by lack of smaller options (particularly for parents who need to fit multiple car seats in a vehicle) and fear of them or their kids being injured by other drivers in comically oversized vehicles.
@Not_mikey @Wxfisch Yes, the average consumer is quite susceptible to marketing and follows trends in everything from clothes to food & drink to toothbrushes. Many will look around at their peers and try to “keep up with the Joneses”. Rather than evidence that car companies are simply responding to consumer demand, that shows they’re creating the demand that most benefits their bottom line and looser regulation on vehicles classified as light trucks is a big part of why they market what they do.
Many sedans in the US are quite a bit larger than their global counterparts. That also assumes that all sedans are somewhat fungible which also isn’t true. It’s common for foreign manufacturers to only introduce longer wheelbase versions of vehicles in the US but offer shorter wheelbases in Europe and Asia, thus includes sedans and coupes, but also minivans and trucks. I’d be somewhat interested in a VW id.Buzz, but aside from software issues they only offer the larger variant in the States which won’t even fit in my garage. Even the somewhat normal sized Ioniq 6 we got is way wider and longer than we’d ideally like, but there are no other options to get something in a saner size on Hyundai/Kias eGMP platform which has tons of benefits (higher voltage packs for faster charging, solid and relatively affordable technology options, and full V2L capabilities).
This ignores the role of advertising in making people want things.
They wouldn’t do it if it didn’t work.
Also the companies either not selling smaller models at all or selling under powered econobox trash.
YSK: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compliance_car
Some jurisdictions require that auto makers offer low or no emission vehicles, a vehicle is considered a “compliance car” if it is clear that the company producing it is only doing so in order to comply with these regulations, rather than viewing them as a source of profit. This is generally identified by low production volume, sales limited to only regions where the law requires it, and low effort design.
They don’t sell them because they make a bigger profit on giant trucks even if they have to pay for ads to convince people to buy them.
They would be advertising anyway, but yes people do have a tendency to see more value in volume even if the value isn’t actually there. It goes along with the US fascination with buying in bulk.
Yes, but what they would be advertising would be different. They want people to buy more of the thing that makes them the most money.
If small efficient cars were more profitable they would advertise them instead of giant luxury trucks.
It’s safer for drunk driving if the other cars are the ones turned to smithereens.
The bottom right is really the only valid reason. I’d love to get a small car but between them not really being sold in the US anymore and the crash incompatibility, I gotta pass.although there is increasingly little to live for so maybe I’ll just get a donorcycle and say fuck it
Get a small enough car and you can just pass under them.
I settled on a mid sized suv as the compromise. Seating for four, and I have a family of four. Big enough to go with traffic but small enough to be reasonably efficient. Big enough to carry a lot but small enough to fit in narrow lanes and parking spots
No, it’s a terrible reason. It’s complicit with the system for a level of danger reduction that is really not enough, and intentionally endangering other kids for your own children’s benefits. You merely continue the cycle. It’s short sighted at best.
Well, if you kill an entire family or children, you take multiple future gigacar drivers off the road, so in a way it’s actually rather productive for the movement.
We have pretty small cars but we often are transporting six people. So we end up driving two cars pretty regularly. It’s not so bad when we’re just going across town, but we’re traveling to Toronto and Florida for two trips this summer. We have rented a big SUV for trips like that before, but it costs more overall and sometimes it’s nice to have two vehicles while we’re there because we don’t all six want to go the same place every moment of our week.
Most big SUVs I see have one person in them though.
Ever tried a minivan?
This. The solution is a people-carrier. The ground clearance of an SUV or the cargo bed of a pickup truck won’t help with anything.
The ID. Buzz looks pretty sick atm, but it’s a tad expensive.
Plus it only has two cup holders.
Wow. My old broke down Kia minivan has thirteen cupholders.
My old Odyssey had 18!
That’s honestly crazy. I used to joke that the van has 13 cupholders and 7 seats because in Korea it’s a 13 seater. But in what world are you using 18?
That is really cool, I wish it was more practical for me, and that is more than just the expensive price tag. I’ve purchased quite a few new vehicles, but none of them were ever over $22k. I do like a lot about it, but I also regularly drive long distances on remote dirt/unimproved roads and sometimes drive cross country for 20 hours nonstop. So for now a smaller vehicle with more ground clearance and range makes more sense.
Yes, technically I own one but it has major issues and we use it only as our version of a truck to go the two miles to the local Home Depot. It loses all power and will stop if you try to drive it up a hill. But I can fit a full sheet of plywood in the back with the middle seats out. We’ve tried renting minivans, but we’ve had two problems.
One is that they’re never available - they’ll take your reservation but when you show up to get it there are none available so they substitute a large SUV like a Chevy Tahoe. A Tahoe has way more space and would cost more to rent, which are benefits, but they’re also far less fuel efficient which isn’t great.
The other problem is space. A minivan can move six people but modern minivans don’t really have space for luggage for six people for nine days in the back. I even own a nice hard sided roof luggage carrier I use with my Subaru Crosstrek, but rentals never have the roof bars you need to mount it up there.
For now, our little cars are decently fuel efficient. I would consider buying another minivan but our youngest is 15 so I think at some point soon we’ll need less people-carrying capacity.
A Tahoe has way more space
A Tahoe has way more bulk in terms of exterior dimensions than a minivan, but I dispute the idea that it has way more interior passenger+cargo space. Even if the width and length are the same (e.g. big enough for a sheet of plywood), the minivan’s interior should be taller (because the floor isn’t so high above the ground) and the seats should be better at getting out of the way.
A minivan can move six people but modern minivans don’t really have space for luggage for six people for nine days in the back.
I’ve owned a long wheelbase Ford Aerostar and, more recently, a Kia Sedona, and I’ve gotta admit I miss the Aerostar. Still, the Sedona definitely isn’t small.
I currently own a Kia Sedona but as I explained in another comment I only use it to drive two miles or less on flat ground. It came in two wheelbase lengths, and we have the longer wheelbase so there’s a decent amount of space for luggage, but I can’t drive it anywhere I would bring luggage.
Most modern minivans are smaller than that Sedona and have significantly less cargo space. If you’ve never driven or ridden in a Tahoe, they are bigger on the inside, no question. Yeah they’re higher off the ground, but they’re taller, wider and longer. So if everyone has a small suitcase and a backpack, even if only the suitcases fit in the back, the backpacks can fit in the seating space much more comfortably than in a van.
Also, I’ve never intentionally rented a Tahoe. I try to rent a minivan, I get a Tahoe. But they are more comfortable for a group of six, and that matters if you’re driving 17 hours straight or something like that.
It came in two wheelbase lengths, and we have the longer wheelbase
TIL! Mine is apparently the long wheelbase version, so that’s nice.
Most modern minivans are smaller than that Sedona and have significantly less cargo space. If you’ve never driven or ridden in a Tahoe, they are bigger on the inside, no question.
I have been in the inside of a Tahoe, but I admit, it’s been a very long time so I guess the new ones may very well be bigger than I expect.
Also, I thought the Kia Sedona was a “modern minivan.” Mine’s only… uh… 18 years old. Oh.
Well, it’s modern compared to my other cars, at least.
Still, I don’t understand why a 2025 minivan would be smaller, especially when the trend for every other class of vehicle is to get bigger over time.
I’d guess it’s mostly about fuel efficiency which is legitimate. I think the Tahoe falls into a light truck category because it’s on a truck frame. Not sure about the newest models, but it was on a truck frame for most of its existence, and those towing ratings are higher than ever.
“Light trucks” or vehicles like large SUVs don’t have to meet the same efficiency standards as most cars, minivans and smaller SUVs which often use more of unibody frame. It’s bad regulation at work.
My taxes paid for the road, I’m going to use the road. It’s called getting value for your money, walklet-tier comic XD
That is eleven reasons!
honestly, top right is relatable.
Just rent a truck from home Depot. They’re like $45 a day.
72 bucks for 3 hrs, plus gas.
Don’t believe the advertising lies.
Source: rented one to move last year.
Still cheaper then the extra car payment for getting a car twice as big as you need for rare occasions.
No argument there.
And fuck you if you’re under 25, I guess
Oh well in that case, if 24 year olds can’t move pianos, sure: fuck pedestrian safety, non huge SUV drivers and the climate.
It doesn’t actually have to be either-or; we can have trucks with significant hauling capacity and have safe roads. My truck is smaller than my last minivan, with a bigger box than most new trucks. I’d go even smaller, but kei trucks aren’t very common here
For the roads to be safe, they need to be designed for these trucks to feel like they are intruders that inconvenience others and so must slow down and politely respect pedestrians and bikes. As opposed to building cities with the comfort of trucks as the first priority, where everyone else feels like they’re intruding in the SUV’s waya and inconvenience them.
if anyone else didn’t know who https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thorstein_Veblen was
Dey stupid and it makes their penis seem bigger.
I just think the mindset is a left over from the colonial days when there was so much land to settle on, that building big is not an issue. The principle carried over to many other things, like having big possessions are seen as good.
And the other reason: To make yourself feel better about your teeny weenie.
Does anyone really need 7 children?
Fittingly, seven of Charles Darwin’s children survived to adulthood.
I’m 6’3 and abnormally long in the torso, so I sit really tall. I do not fit in a lot of cars without my head touching the ceiling, sometimes crammed into it. I keep trying to save money by renting mid-size cars when I travel and it’s fucking miserable. Literally driving with my seat all the way down and still having to either lean my seat way back and barely reach the wheel or cock my head below the closed visor the entire time just to see straight ahead. Vans, SUVs and trucks are the only vehicles I’ve been able to even sit in comfortably since I was like 15 or 16. I wish I could drive a compact and save money on gas. But there are a LOT of cars that are off the table for me because I simply cannot fit in them.
6ft8 here, with most of my height in my legs. I feel you, even large cars often have absurdly large dashboards and I still won’t fit in them.
I’ve had to ask to swap my rental car several times already.
I’m also 6’3" and long in the torso. If I lower the seat in my Golf as low as it can go I have 4 inches of headroom and if I push it all of the way back I can barely reach the pedals. I keep my seat back fully vertical as well; I can’t stand for it to be reclined even a little. Either you have been driving the wrong cars, or you are looking for an excuse.
Huh. I haven’t tried a Volkswagen. I wonder if that is typical of their models.
Either you have been driving the wrong cars
Apparently. I’ve tried many.
or you are looking for an excuse.
No need for the sass. Like I said, I have tried. I also drive a van now becuase we were fostering for a while and needed the seating, but I would love to downsize if only for the mileage improvement.
Sorry for the snark. I work with altogether too many people who say they have the same reason for driving their huge brodozers, and when I tell them about my VW they dismiss it as too small. I shouldn’t take that out in random internet strangers.
6’1 and similar. I cannot ride in a Toyota, regardless of the size of it.
My head is out the sunroof in a 2012 sequoia, and those things are bigger than a small truck.
6’4" here. My height is mostly in my torso (38" inseam) and I drive a 2017 Mini Cooper and have been driving Minis since I started driving. I don’t fit in most compacts but do fit comfortably there. So, yeah, still not a great reason to be driving oversized cars.
To be clear, 38" inseam means fully half of your height is in your legs (6’4" is 76"). By comparison, I wear 36" inseam and the bottom of my pants tuck under my heel when I’m not in shoes. So I think my torso has a few inches on yours.
Regardless though, I have not driven an exhaustive list of small cars. I have never tried a Mini Cooper. Maybe I would fit fine, idk. I just said that I have tried to drive a variety of rental cars and have yet to find one that fits me. I fit just fine in my Sienna.
