Most of you said you’d switch to Proton Mail for the privacy, even if it meant giving up some of the convenience of Gmail.
honestly i believe the reason so many people are never gonna switch from google is because so many services allow you to use your google as an easy one click register/login. its so convenient that i have friends who’d rather have all their privacy be infringed than to give that up.
not to mention the dozens of services google provides themselves, from maps to mail to search to whatever the fuck
similar to apple, its an ecosystem. one of convenience.
100%. it’s SO annoying to remember passwords especially when my phone doesn’t auto save them 50% of the time because it doesn’t feel like it.
Why doesn’t everyone just use a better manager like Lastpass or Bitwarden, it’s super easy to use.
I do use Bitwarden, and in my experience of >1 year, it’s good enough. It sometimes doesn’t save automatically and if you save (for example) a McDonalds login on PC, it won’t offer to fill on their app. Also you cant save new passwords offline which is a pretty rare situation but it made me want to rip my hair out (granted I didn’t have enough food that day so I was angry to begin with).
Minor gripes for sure, but Google doesn’t have the same annoyances. Not worth going back to Google though.I guess I’ve always just made the new passwords in Bitwarden and have it fill in the form rather than fill in the form and let Bitwarden save it. Do you not use generated passwords? Can’t help you on the offline thing, I see how that would be annoying.
It’s called the Googleverse.
Many people don’t know the difference between the Google search bar and the URL bar anymore.
What features does Gmail even have to sacrifice? It’s just basic email.
Email doesn’t need “features.” It’s been a solved problem for decades.
I agree.
I guess most of these people don’t understand the difference between the protocol/server and the client software, and most of those use the web ui anyhow.
Moving away from gmail is one thing, but Proton’s CEO is a massive cunt that I wouldn’t personally trust anymore. I have an ongoing subscription for some of their services (including email, but I don’t really use it), and I’m going to move on from there after the subscription expires.
not to mention Proton’s PR team has mod positions in the subreddit and lemmy community and like to do some pretty aggressive censoring of anything that refers to the CEO’s support of Trump in hopes of gaslighting everyone to forget about it.
I got banned from the lemmy community recently and my posts removed as ‘misinformation’ for talking about it… like man the entire internet saw him say this shit.
Yeah, this isn’t really scientific or anything. The details of he survey aren’t really discussed in detail, and its not random sampling… Its readers of android authority.
That’s nearly equivalent of saying, the majority of people in this privacy group care more about privacy than google features.
I’d be interested to see a broad survey like this though to get a real sense of how the general publics views on privacy are changing.
Andy Yen tipped his hand, he’s a trumpbitch. Money you pay them supports a facist fuck
Fun fact: Fascism is not thinking republicans will do better than democrats in pursuing antitrust battles against big tech for the benefit of smaller businesses.
Please don’t use this word at random, plenty of people in my country (and many others) died fighting fascism.
Fun fact: Trump is 100% a facist fuck, which is who I was referring to. He’s a self enriching oligarch wanna be who is literally killing people.
GOP sucks Trump ass on the reg. GOP is not only complicit, they enable, and support authoritarianism and anti freedom patterns.
Get your head in the fucking game if you’re correcting people.
PEOPLE ARE DYING NOW
which is who I was referring to
So when you said
money you pay them go to support a facist
You meant Trump…Sorry, I am going to doubt that. I am quite sure that sentence meant “money you pay to Proton go to their CEO (a fascist)”. Why money would go to Trump otherwise…is Proton sponsoring Trump? Hence my comment.
Alternatively, your comment was completely off-topic and unrelated to the post. Possible, I simply assumed you were not lost on the internet.
They try to tell me that I have to control my reactions when I respond. It’s hard for me.
I apologize for my intensity. Sometime I see connections that are clearly self deterministic.
✌️
deleted by creator
Goodluck with spam and your mails in spam
deleted by creator
I highly recommend Disroot.org. I switched as part of my deGoogling and I am very happy.
If users want privacy, then they should have never used gmail in the first place.
The ONLY reason I’m on Proton mail is because My Bank insists on it.
Your bank wanrs proton?
Yes. Because they have “secure” in the name. 🙄
Like Google is going to do that. The entire reason for gmails existence is to gather data from its users.
It’s ridiculous how user data has become such a big commodity.
You mean to say that if a service or product is free, we are the product?
Samsung: buy device, we collect your data Apple: buy device, we collect your data Google: buy device, we collect your data Tesla: buy a car, we collect your data Uber: pay for delivery, we collect your data Amazon: pay for subscription, buy items, sell items, we collect your data. Netflix: literally the only way to interact with us is to pay a subscription, we collect your data. YouTube: pay more than every other streaming service to get music, video and shorts with no ads, we are still collecting your data.
“If it’s free, you’re the product” has never been and will never be true. You’re the product so long as advertising exists, paying for shit doesn’t change a thing. They don’t care you bought it once because they want you to buy again and again and only from them. It’s a statement to make people think they deserve the treatment they’re getting and its gaslighting.
No, if a company has shareholders then you are the product
Companies exist only to make profits for the investors.
The users getting any value is just a happy little accident.
and not just that, but to make as much money in as short a time as possible. Fuck the future, short term goals are all that matter.
Ultra Private E-Mail
look inside
The most basic ass unencrypted email
Is Proton still an alternative? I subscribed to Tuta for a year but I’m not too happy with their apps. Feels like low-grade web apps disguised as mobile apps.
Used it for years now, 100% worth the money and the bundled cloud storage and vpn are both great.
I’d say yes. Have been using ProtonMail as main mail service for several years now. There are some limitations because of encryption, but for the most part it’s working almost the same as GMail. I’ve had Tutamail too, but I too didn’t like the design of their app, it was very restricted and lacked features of almost any kind.
Absolutely not, Proton’s CEO went on a rant about how he loves Trump. I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s all funneled to his dad Putin. I’ve been looking for Proton thats not Proton
He never said he loved Trump. He said he supported the push against big tech which seemed most likely with republicans.
Yes still very dumb and republicans are lying sacks of shit.
I dont use proton and I’m kinda sceptical about them. Especially since Switzerland is potentionaly introducing a very privacy unfriendly law. And also because of said tweet, but please state facts and don’t exaggerate since it really doesn’t help with anything.
The tweet (can a tweet even qualify as a rant, given the length?):
Great pick by @readDonaldTrump. 10 years ago, Republicans were the party of big business and Dems stood for the little guys [small businesses, n.d.r. as explained on reddit], but today the tables have completely turned. People forget that the current antitrust actions against Big Tech were started under the first Trump admin.
A rant about how he loves Trump?
I think I’m leaning towards your side here. I’m sorry for starting a war in the comments, by the way. 😅 It was a hot topic!
I still find it weird that the Proton CEO is so adamant about pitting republicans against democrats so hard, like it’s black or white, red pill vs blue pill. If he supports the choice that was made, he could easily just say that he thinks the choice was good, without putting all the focus on who made the choice. That’s the weird part for me. 😓 That’s what makes me suspicious of the intentions of the tweet.
But yeah, anyway, it definitely wasn’t a love letter like that, no. 👍
Most companies don’t have these PR problems
I know the facts.
And that’s why I am calling you out for misrepresenting the facts. There is just no way that tweet can be interpreted as a “rant to say he loves trump”.
So, “there has been a controversy about a tweet from the CEO who praises Trump’s pick for antitrust and saw it as a confirmation that republicans are more likely to pursue antitrust battles against big tech, compared to democrats” =/= “the CEO went on a rant to say how he loves Trump”.
Disagree, it completely reads as a tweet supporting trump, and the “official response” that was later contracted by a more moderate official response definitely felt like a rant.
I’ve been watching Proton since then and they’ve very much backed away from the ceo’s pro-Trump pro-Republican position, so I’ve continued to use their services, but mostly because I’ve already invested time and money into using them. But they lost my trust and I have not recommended them in the same way I used it before this happened.
There is not a single comment either on reddit or elsewhere that shows love for Trump. Supporting a Trump’s choice doesn’t mean supporting Trump.
Supporting his choices and the Republican party at large is the problematic part. I don’t care if he loves Trump or not.
“Here is our official response, also available on the Mastodon post in the screenshot: Corporate capture of Dems is real. In 2022, we campaigned extensively in the US for anti-trust legislation. Two bills were ready, with bipartisan support. Chuck Schumer (who coincidently has two daughters working as big tech lobbyists) refused to bring the bills fora vote. At a 2024 event covering antitrust remedies, out of all the invited senators, just a single one showed up JD Vance. By working on the front lines of many policy issues, we have seen the shift between Dems and Republicans over the past decade first hand. Dems had a choice between the progressive wing (Bernie Sanders, etc), versus corporate Dems, but in the end money won and constituents lost. Until corporate Dems are thrown out, the reality is that Republicans remain more likely to tackle Big Tech abuses.”
I think their new (not so new anymore) mobile app has been a major improvement. It is much faster and usable IMHO. This on Android (degoogled).
I am quite happy with the service, and so is my family (non-techie).
Sadly, that is true for many email providers. I do use Tuta, because I use web apps only. However, a decent provider is Disroot. You do have to set up the encryption things by yourself, but IIRC, you can use any desktop/mobile/whatever client you want to.
Gladly leave Gmail, but DEFINITELY not for Proton
Some food for thought, (excerpt from Louis Rossmann’s reply to the top pinned comment):
"with regards to products: if you want to only buy shoes, razors, cars, caulking materials, etc, made by companies & people who support all of your political beliefs, you’re going to lose that game very fast. you will waste your life doing the following:
- researching every item you buy to death
- making these items yourself once you realize it’s impossible to find each item you want made by someone who mirrors your ideology
- give up & live in a cave
The moment you go down that road of throwing away software products and services because they are made by people whose political beliefs do not reflect yours, you are going to end up living in a cave. That is a lonely world. It doesn’t even work!! People who bought the Tesla Model 3 a few years ago would have Ford F-250 Turbo Diesel drivers speed up in front of them and roll coal in their face. And now that same person is getting called a Nazi!!!
the political beliefs of the software i use are irrelevant to me. They only become relevant when these questions arise:
- does it stop me from using the software the way i want?
- do their political beliefs keep them from being able to make a functioning product?
for gnome, #2 is yes. gnome was bad 10 years ago,it was bad 5 years ago, and it’s bad now. i used gnome for a very short time period earlier in 2024 out of morbid curiosity. my machine had 128 gigabytes of ram, rtx-2080, threadripper 2950x processor and gnome still lagged. XFCE just worked! on top of that, gnome sucked to use. i am not using gnome: whether it’s “woke” or “anti woke” or whatever else.
if we’re at a point in the world where we choose our web browser by the political views of its programmers… we’re screwed"
This argument is so weird to me.
Maybe I’m a huge nerd, but I love researching who I’m supporting behind the products and services I use, just in general. If I happen to learn someone has weirdo politics it’s not “researching everything to death,” it’s being careful with my hard earned money.
I understand you perspective completely. I assume it is a similar battle to achieving digital privacy. It is a good fight to fight and research, but a balance must be found between moral purity and actually living life. It’s great when you can get them to align as much as possible, but you could always go further and cut more out, to the point of greatly reducing your quality of life. Maybe you should be reducing your quality, I don’t know.
Like most things, it’s not so black and white as Louis paints it. What products you buy and use absolutely is a political choice, but perfection isn’t the goal. No one has to be a “perfect” consumer to avoid the low hanging fruit like Chick-fil-A or today’s Tesla if those are important issues to you.
Well louis did switch from GrapheneOS tbo BC he didn’t like the dev lol
But fair points
With that being said, Proton is not some sort of gold standard, it is a good email service. There are others.
This argument is really weak.
“If you’re not going to do crunches, pull ups and marine pushups, there’s no point in going for that walk.”
Yes there is! Don’t let the best be the enemy of the good.
It’s not like Proton mail is the only alternative. And like the article points out, you don’t get encryption anyway, since almost no one else you’d be communicating with is going to be on Proton. I use (and recommend) posteo.de but there are other good alternatives for email. But if you want encrypted communication you’ll need to use an app designed for that, not email.
I never quite understand why people use Proton. It just automates the exchange of PGP/GPG keys, but only if the other person also uses Proton, right?
Anyhow, +1 to paying a small amount of money for email. I was with posteo.de myself for many years. I heard mailbox.org is even better/safer and has slightly more features. Both start at 1€/month.
BTW, I set up an eternal redirect email address a long time ago, so I can change the actual provider without having to tell all my contacts.
It also encrypts your emails automatically (both incoming and outgoing) and lets you set PGP keys for any address you want, and fetch/manually trust Proton Mail users’ keys.
encrypts your emails automatically (outgoing)
How does that work for recipients I haven’t shared secrets with?
BTW any decent email client has an option or plugin to do that.
The outgoing email leaving the server isn’t encrypted.
The copy that’s stored on your account is encrypted on device with your PGP key.
But if you have a redirect isnt that service the issue? As in your gmail forwards to proton?
What issue?
I didn’t mean to say that my eternal email has anything to do with Proton.
Sorry I am trying to understand the usefulness of an eternal redirect email address? Im just not familiar with the set up or reasoning.
Yeah same, so I went with Tuta which is a bit cheaper and encrypts more.
Yes, tuta encrypts the subject, which is not encrypted in Proton for example.
To be precise, even when an email is not from Proton user, they encrypt it with ypur public key, send it to you and delete it (they call it zero access). Which is the best you can get. Also managing PGP keys, especially on multiple devices is a pain.
This is actually good to know. OTOH, aren’t all messages transfered using encryption with most email providers/clients anyhow (TLS/SSL)? This is mostly about making sure your data on the servers stays safe even if someone gains access, right?
So, TLS is just a point-to-point encryption protocol, it doesn’t prevent anybody of the parties involved from having access to the content. Once the email is encrypted with PGP, Proton loses permanently access to this content.
So this is pretty much what happens with a Gmail <-> Outlook and a Gmail <-> Proton email.
Gmail to outlook:
A writes the email in their editor <- TLS -> Google servers <-TLS-> outlook servers <-TLS-> B reads the email. While every communication is encrypted with TLS, every server has access to its content. Every time B accesses the email from outlook servers (I.e., their inbox), the data is transferred with TLS, but outlook is the “other end of the tunnel”, so it has access to this content.
Gmail to Proton:
A writes the email in their editor <- TLS -> Google servers <-TLS-> Proton servers -> encrypt original message with B’s public key and discard original -> send to B inbox -> Proton client decrypts email -> B accesses it.
So yes, it is
about making sure your data on the servers stays safe even if someone gains access
As long as you consider the email provider part of those potential “someone”.
The way I would say it essentially is that PGP encryption (even in cases where the original messages was not using it) still gives you the confidentiality property of PGP, even without the integrity and non-repudiation properties (which are not possible to guarantee with respect of the original message of course). In other words, the biggest difference is that the email provider doesn’t have access to your stuff.
Thanks!
I just created an account with mailbox.org - now I just need to spend the next months transferring all relevant emails.
spend the next months transferring all relevant emails.
Why don’t you just keep them on your machine? No need to clutter online storage with old mails.
Oh wait, you probably don’t use email client software.
I think you’ve misunderstood, and my writing was bad. I meant transferring all my accounts to the new email domain, not move all emails (I have already downloaded them) 🙂
You must have a lot of email accounts.
My password manager has more than 600 accounts stored… Though, I’ll only transfer the ones I still use lol
