No earphone jack again. That’s a bit sad. Even though I mainly use BLT earbuds, I still sometimes wish I could use my wired headphones. It’s just a small inconvenience
I had a phone without before, that one came with a simple cheap passive adapter for USB-C to 3.5mm headset. You lose out on using headphones while charging, but other than that I was never really inconvenienced…
After having a phone without a 3.5mm port or a microSD card slot, the top 2 features I want on a phone are a 3.5mm port and a microSD card slot.
Shame Sony discontinued their Xperia 5 series, even if they were also excessively priced.
aw man, this is the first i’m hearing about discontinuation. apparently it’s because people want larger phones?!
i have a 5 IV and it is by far the largest phone i’ve ever owned… i wish it was like an inch smaller. but it was the only model i could find that doesn’t have a non-rectangular screen. these bloody camera cutouts are everywhere and i never even use the front camera.
Yep… everyone wants phablets. Apparently.
I don’t mind the cutouts (if done right), they just sit in the notification bar, so they never obscure anything anyway. That’s a place Sony could have shaved off the extra height imo, the top and bottom bezels are pretty unnecessary.
We are slowly moving to under-screen cameras now though.
We are slowly moving to under-screen cameras now though.
Nothing better than a selfie from a low angle, right?
i think they mean “under” as in “behind”.
lol, that’s very possible
i mean the bezels together are less than 1cm. and the notch takes space from notifications, with two sim cards and a vpn active that shit overflows instantly anyway.
Fair, I suppose it depends on how the software handles it too. Personally I never let notifications stack up and the VPN for me is on the other side. I’d personally rather have the shorter phone and a cutout.
vpn is on the right, yeah. but this is with just one sim:
with two i get another signal strength and wifi calling symbol. it’s already collapsing them when not on the quick setting screen, which is very frustrating.
The Sony form factor is the best on the market IMO. You can hold it in you hand and get more screen in the height.
agree, i just wish they kept a model like the Z* Compact around.
They’re really no different to a regular iPhone or iPhone pro in terms of size.
https://www.phonearena.com/phones/size/Apple-iPhone-16-Pro,Sony-Xperia-5-V/phones/12239,12193
What’s the use case for microSD slots on phones these days anyway?
If it’s (just) to avoid paying Google or Apple storage fees, you can work around that by buying one or several HDDs to keep at home and sync stuff over the local network, possibly even build a server and access your stuff remotely.
I really don’t understand the need for that much space on the go, though. Are you watching entire series on your phone?
“just”, I think not giving money to Apple or Google anything is a perfectly good reason alone to want expandable storage.
Phone manufacturers charge a massive premium for more storage on a phone, storage which is then lost if the phone dies. A microSD card can be moved around and they cost little.
Not everyone has a home server, in fact a very very small percentage do and being able to store their photos and what-not on a microSD card is very valuable. The freedom to add more storage is a good thing to have. Most people can understand an SD card, but not how to setup an entire home server with syncing etc, let alone exposing that to the web to access it anywhere. It also costs money to run, a microSD card doesn’t.
The only reason we don’t have expandable storage or a 3.5mm port anymore is: money. They want to sell you that cloud service, upcharge you for more internal storage and make you buy their bluetooth earbuds.
I hope you’re not suggesting that people store all of their photos and movies and stuff on their phones SD card and SD card only……
SD cards are absurdly volatile and prone to corruption.
Of course not… people should still do regular backups.
I understand all of that and I agree with you. Not wanting to pay monthly storage fees is perfectly reasonable too. I know I did everything to avoid giving Google any money for storage.
But microSD slots on phones aren’t coming back, and manufacturers are giving you 512GB of internal storage at most, so we need to move on with the times.
I don’t have a home server (yet) either, but I do have 2 TB disks I use to store all the important stuff I want to save forever. Nothing lives on my phone so I’m fine with 128GB.
Local syncing can be done just by installing Syncthing or Omnisend, and everything gets transferred through your home Wi-Fi. No need for complicated setups. I mentioned home servers as an example but you certainly don’t need one.
MicroSD cards also die so I don’t know why you used that as a slight against internal phone storage. You should always have backups.
Storage is dirt cheap these days, it makes no sense to hinder yourself buying niche phones, often at inflated prices, just for a feature that is easily worked around. In my opinion.
I disagree about this being a good solution. USB-C is not meant to take the strain of being used as an audio port when being used in the go so there is risk of damaging the port while a headphone jack is more stable and allows the plug to rotate. Plus I don’t want to have a dingle I can forget when in a rush.
They should make cases with the adapter built in, the way they used to (still do?) for external battery packs.
Or just put the port in the phone.
Plus I don’t want to have a dingle I can forget when in a rush.
Just have the dongle permanently attached to your earbuds like it’s a part of the cable.
Awesome solution. Remove the port that everything used to have and make consumers buy adapters. I have like 5 headphones. Should I go buy an adapter for each one? Not to mention that I can easily fix a headphone cable but if a 3.5 to usb-c adapter breaks, it basically becomes junk.
you use all five every week?
I use them and that’s more than reason enough to want a reliable, small, cheap, jack that literally has no downsides and lets me use my devices how I want to use them.
Unless you want to use them with a device that doesn’t have a headphone jack.
Interesting, I would think that they would consider being eternally connected to a power bank when designing USB-C.
You also have to remember to have that adapter with you
An issue shared with the headphones themselves
I just leave the adapter plugged into the headphones. Then there’s nothing extra to manage.
I have like a dozen pairs of headphones
The adapters are dirt cheap, buy doezen of them
No thank you.
how many do you use per week?
If you need to plug the headphones into the adapter, you can just leave them plugged in after disconnecting from the phone
This way, the headphones almost become ones with USB-C connectors than auxiliary barrels.
You can find adapters that can charge while still having a 3.5mm back
I use one of those daily and god they’re all terrible. They’re huge and they all break really easily. My phone is fucking huge, just give me a built in headphone jack!
fast charging / USB-PD may not work, and 3.5mm media controls may not pass through properly
I have a tablet that came with a C to 3.5 adapter and it worked well enough for a bit but soon enough it was only intermittently allowing the headphone connection to work, with a message about the port being dirty or something. Yet I could go right from unplugging that and putting the charger in and it worked fine.
There’s just no substitute for a dedicated port, especially when it barely takes up any room
It’s really a small inconvenience, but using an adapter would mean I’d be prone to misplace it when I use my headphones on anything else, so it hardly makes anything better
The reason for not using a headphone jack is making it simpler for the manufacturer, one less connector to handle which also limits how slim a phone can be.
I’m not saying this is good for the consumer, but there are reasons for integrating the functionality into the USB-C port.
For $700 I’m not interested in compromising my own convenience for theirs.
Fair, though the fact doesn’t exist in a vacuum.
If you want easily replaceable parts and a system that can unlock the bootloader for example, your argument can be made for 99% of phones on the market. The more requirements you add, the smaller the scope gets until there are no devices left to choose from.
We were doing perfectly fine 10 years ago and manufacturing has only gotten more advanced, the only real reason the 3.5mm port was removed is because Apple wanted to sell people their AirPods. That’s literally it. The rest of the manufacturers soon followed suit when they realised how many people were buying AirPods.
Then you’re going to have to go and start your own phone company. Good luck to you, let us know when your phone comes out.
These points were all disproved long ago. The jack is a the same thickness as the display.
The reason is because BT headphones have a much higher margin, and need to be replaced every few years because of the battery (if not already replaced because they were lost or damaged).
It’s just a dumb cash grab.
This would make sense if the only Bluetooth headphones that worked with the phone were made by the same company, but alas, that’s not how it works.
The reason they don’t have a headphone jack anymore is because it’s easier to make without it, saves money, has a built in replacement in BT, and people overwhelmingly love BT headphones due to being wireless.
It’s not hard to manufacture a headphone jack. We’ve been doing it since the 80s. Probably costs them a penny BOM.
I don’t think his point was the jack itself but the device around the jack. Physically and electronically.
That’s what I’m also talking about.
one less connector to handle which also limits how slim a phone can be.
The headphone jack is 3.5mm. iPhones are ~7.5mm thick, more than double. The smallest phone available on the market is 4.2mm.
That means the audio still goes through another DAC, lowering the sound quality, compared to an analog 3.5 jack. Also, who wants to further risk wearing out\vreaking their charge port, jack inputs almost seem like they can’t break.
Technically it only goes through 1 dac, not “another one”. But still, yeah, your phone’s dac is most likely a lot better than the one on a $10 adapter. However, the usb-c spec does allow an analog audio signal passthrough. Whether that’s available or not depends on the phone I guess.
Too bad LG got out of the phone biz. They had the best dacs and some good phones.
Damn right. LG G5 for example was a pretty interesting concept that could’ve evolved into something cool.
Not having a headphone jack is just a slap in the face from a company whose whole image is supposed to be longevity and eco-friendly.
No one has been using aux cable mobile headphones for the past 10 years. Headphone jack is e-waste at this point. bluetooth audio is great and if you really want to be a boomer you can use the usb C headphones.
Headphone jack is e-waste
you can use the usb C headphones
What the absolute fuck are you talking about? What am I supposed to do with the dozen wired headphones I already have? Some of them decades old? Throw them in the garbage? Sounds real eco-friendly.
bluetooth audio is great
It is. We had it on phones since before the original iPhone. No one wants to take that away.
Problem is BT headphones last 2 years then they go in the garbage because the batteries are dead. How eco-friendly is that!?
Yes if they’ve lasted decades thats their job done. Now people are buying usb C headphones and there is no need to continue to support decades old standards. The ewaste from a pair of headphones is tiny so its not worth fretting over.
Also BT headphones last longer than 2 years. Mine are 1st gen samsung buds and going on 5 years at this point and still hold enough charge to listen to music during my work day. If im going to be using them all day I have 1 in and 1 charging in the case and then I can easily have music for 10+ hours on a 5 year old device. If I threw them away today I would consider them to have not been ewaste.
Yes if they’ve lasted decades thats their job done
No it means they’ll essentially last indefinitely, unlike BT buds.
Now people are buying usb C headphones and there is no need to continue to support decades old standards
No, what’s happened is that we went from a single open standard for audio jacks to competing standards (actually 3 of them before the EU stepped in and forced Apple to quit their bullshit). And gained nothing in the process.
The ewaste from a pair of headphones is tiny so its not worth fretting over.
It’s not a pair of headphones, it’s millions of audio devices.
Problem is BT headphones last 2 years then they go in the garbage because the batteries are dead. How eco-friendly is that!?
My 7 years old bluetooth headphone would disagree.
It is. We had it on phones since before the original iPhone. No one wants to take that away.
And no one except a vocal minority want to keep it. There are a lot on data on that, and manufacturer make their decision on that data.
But lets ignore that, and let’s take my viewpoint as a customer. I don’t want a port I have no use for. I don’t want a DAC I have no use for. I don’t want the extra weight that comes with them.
My needs conflict with yours, so what’s the only way to make both of us somewhat happy? That’s by making the 3.5mm jack an addon, which is what any manufacturer that does not focus on music listening would do.
And no one except a vocal minority want to keep it. There are a lot on data on that,
I would love to see the data that says everyone wants wired devices only. I don’t believe you.
don’t want a port I have no use for.
Why would you even care!?
I don’t want the extra weight that comes with them.
😆 Buddy if you don’t want extra weight you need to talk to these OEMs about making their phones out of giant slabs of glass. A 1g connector isn’t going to make a difference. You’re being completely ridiculous.
My needs conflict with yours,
No they don’t. They can meet both of our needs by including a jack. Simple as.
I’m voluntarily exagerating my point here for irony sake.
My needs isn’t more important than anyone else, but I wanted to point out the selfishness of the oposite point of view by making mine as selfish. Those in favor of keeping a jack port voluntarily choose to ignore any alternative, while trying to force their need on other people.
But it is true I do not want that port back. It is redundant, has no advantages over a dongle, and it inconveniences could easily be overcome by simply adding a second usb-c port. No need for internal DAC, you’d be able to do far more than you’ll ever be able to do with a 3.5mm jack, and you’ll be able to charge it while listening to your music with a wired headphone. All that with a smaller and more flexible port.
And it would take you 5min searching the web to get good review about usbc DAC with actually good sound, even better than any internal DAC.
But to save you a click, you have the Apple one, which has good review while being able to drive almost all headphones but the most energy intensive of them. It cost a whopping… $10.
As for the precise number, you can find them on market studies. Unfortunately they are quite pricy, and as I’m not in that field, I do not have access to them. But Fairphone does, and if they don’t bother adding that port back, they are most probably basing their decision on them.
My needs isn’t more important than anyone else, but I wanted to point out the selfishness of the oposite point of view by making mine as selfish.
There’s nothing selfish here. Keeping the jack benefits everyone except Apple and other BT headphone OEMs. It doesn’t hurt anyone else.
has no advantages over a dongle
The advantage is that you don’t need a dongle…
and it inconveniences easily be overcome by simply adding a second usb-c port
Still requires carrying a dongle or buying a pair of headphones that only works with phones and computers, and not the vast array of other devices that still use headphone jacks, new and old. So that solves absolutely nothing. As I said elsewhere, we’ve created a competing standard, for no reason.
you’d be able to do far more than you’ll ever be able to do with a 3.5mm jack
What? Do you think we’re suggesting removing the USB port? What are you talking about?
And it would take you 5min searching the web to get good review about usbc DAC with actually good sound, even better than any internal DAC.
I don’t want to search the web. I don’t want a DAC. I just want to plug in my headphones. This is absurd.
It cost a whopping… $10.
$10 to buy something that previously cost me $0. Only it’s inevitably going to get lost so you’d better buy a half dozen of them and replace them every few years, so you’re looking at dozens of $ per year for something that was previously completely unnecessary.
As for the precise number…I’m not in that field, I do not have access to them
Yeah, I didn’t think so.
But Fairphone does
Where? If you know they have it, then you must have it as well?
and if they don’t bother adding that port back, they are most probably basing their decision on them.
No, they’re basing that decision on the same thing everyone else is: money. Greed. Much like Apple they also released their own bluetooth headphones at the same time as they removed their headphone jack. But I suppose that’s just coincidence, right?
You can use your dozen wired headphones you already have with a $10 usb-c -> 3.5mm adapter.
Tried that. Gets lost real fast. But thanks “freedom advocate”.
Tried taking better care of your things? I’ve still got mine that came with my pixel 3 and my iPhone 11 Pro.
Okay so now this is my fault. Do you know how many adapters I lost before I needed one?
how else are you supposed to connect it to cars that weren’t made yesterday?
Cars have had bluetooth and usb on their radios for almost 20 years. Even older than that you can replace the stereo for like $30. My car is 2004 and i did a stereo replacement and i’ve got bluetooth, usb C and aux.
I was just hoping a phone like fairphone would give me the option to buy a small module or something to let me do it.
Yes, yes there’s adapters … yes, yes, you don’t need to use it … I understand. I just want it.
You’d ultimately be sacrificing battery size for that Aux jack you hardly use. For most that’s not worth it
I mean … you don’t have to tell me that my opinion isn’t popular, it’s demonstrable. My opinion is statistically insignificant.
There’s a plethora of other things I’d give up like have a slighter bigger phone or a worse camera or wireless charging… I’d also trade those for an SD card slot but no one agrees with me and it’s just something I need to live with.
Not really, no. There are even people that have been able to ADD a headphone jack to iphones that don’t have one.
I never use wired headphones even though I have a jack in my phone. But I have never bought a phone without a jack and probably never will.
Ipersonally think it’s user hostile to remove the jack and also goes directly agains the green profile Fairphone wants to have.
You have these usb-c to mini jack adapters. They are like 5 to 10eu. They are small enough to keep them attached to your jack headphone. It works perfectly for me.
I think it is better to view the usb-c plug as ‘one protocol to rule them all’. If you do so, it makes quite some sense.
Every adapter I had was broken after a year or less. I imagine if you keep them attached to your phone, they’ll break even faster. Do these adapters exist with a 90° angle which might help preventing broken cables?
Not really in the spirit of reducing waste.
Honestly, I don’t really get the people who complain about the lack of 3.5mm jack on a smartphone. If you’re looking for quality you’re more likely to get better quality out quality USB-C headphones than quality 3.5mm headphones due to the USB-C headphones picking up less noise and having its own DAC (which is probably better than the phone DAC that 3.5mm would use).
EDIT: I would’ve been surprised if this take wasn’t controversial. But I guess it’s a good example how the fediverse is not a leftist echo chamber. You have a loud minority complaining about not being able to use a century old technology that the vast majority in the mobile space has moved away from and any compromise on what you want is unacceptable. That’s about as conservative as you can get.
What about the simplicity?
I don’t follow? If you mean simplicity in terms of ease of use you might as well use BT headphones as you don’t have to worry about any wire management. Ease of use is the main reason BT headphones are the go to for most people. No carefully packing the wires so it won’t break, no accidental wiring mess or anything wire related. You just turn them on (which for most in-ear ones just means taking them out of the case), stick them to your ear and you’re good to go.
If you meant anything else by simplicity you need to expand that idea.
I never have to charge my wired headphones.
Nor do I have to buy new batteries or new headphones when they die.
Fair enough, feel free to buy USB-C headphones then.
Edit: Time for the real reply.
I never have to charge my wired headphone.
But you still have to charge your phone. When I charge my phone I also charge my headphones. Most wireless headphones notify you in advance when they’re running low, in my experience enough in advance to not run out before charging again. And finally, charging even once a day is still less overhead than having to manage wires every single time you use the headphones.
Nor do I have to buy new batteries or new headphones when they die
Yeah, you only buy new headphones when the wire gets damaged because that one time you didn’t take good enough care of the wire. I personally had to buy a new set of headphones every year because I’m bad with wires. I’d either store them poorly because I was in a hurry or they’d get stuck on something and get yanked. My first BT headphones lasted me 5 years before starting to have noticeable battery issues and then I still used them for another 3 years before the battery was so dead it wouldn’t live my daily commute.
overall my response boils down to “just use wired then” because the arguments are silly personal preference arguments and the wider consumer market has already decided that wireless is better. But if you want wired nothing is stopping you from getting USB-C wired headphones.
No consumer decided it would be better without it, there’s literally no reason to defend it’s removal. It doesn’t exist because the phone companies wanted to sell their wireless earbuds, that’s it. Anything else they tell you is bullshit.
Why are you trying to justify not having it? You can still use your wireless buds if you want if the port exists, you can still use your USB-C earphones or adapter if you’d like. It can exist in harmony along with other features, like it did for decades before capitalism called for more profits.
Why aren’t you complaining about the removal of a keyboard? Or the removal of SD card slots? Or the removal or the IR light? Or the notification light? or something else that used to be there but isn’t now. Why is the 3.5mm port so special it deserves constant complaining about almost A DECADE LATER? Why must you be these grumpy old men who can’t fucking move on with the times.
I don’t really care if the port is there or not, I’m just fed up with the constant whining about it. It’s gone, the ship has sailed. The majority are more than happy to use wireless headphones, 3.5mm is a niche in the mobile space. There are alternatives if you really like wired headphones. What makes 3.5mm such fucking hill to die on? Nothing. It’s just petty conservatism of people unwilling to move on with the times.
In addition to @timbuck2themoon@sh.itjust.works: I don’t need pairing, I don’t have to deal with bad reception, it’s harder to loose wired ones and even if I loose them, new ones cost a fraction of bt ones. Also I still have some wired ones. The simplicity of simply plugging them in and it just works is something really abstract to alternatives.
Okay? Literally nothing you said applies to USB-C headphones. Except for this part:
The simplicity of simply plugging them in and it just works is something really abstract to alternatives.
What about the price is simultaneous charging?
How often do you charge your phone and listen to music at the same time? And is that really something you cannot compromise on?
You are completely and utterly wrong. I’m pretty sure that a $700 phone’s dac is better than what you can find on a $5 dongle from god knows where. Also, by design there should be no “noise” or “interference” causing issues with the internal dac. If there is, you bought an extremely shitty device.
You know you’ve got not argument when you have to compare a $700 dollar phone to a $5 dongle for your argument to even make sense.
First of all, I seriously doubt any $700 phone without a 3.5mm port is going to have a decent DAC, because there’s no reason for it. In those phones the DAC is used primarily for phone calls. If those phones had a a 3.5mm port and they were flagship phones then maybe they would have higher quality DACs in them, but then they’d also cost more. And secondly, I wasn’t talking about some cheap $5 dongle, I specifically said quality headphones.
You know you’ve got not argument when you have to compare a $700 dollar phone to a $5 dongle for your argument to even make sense.
Oh, so I should buy $100 dongles then? lol Everyone’s argument about the dongles is that they’re super cheap, that’s why I made the comparison.
In those phones the DAC is used primarily for phone calls.
Oh really? And how exactly do you think that the phone is generating the audio that comes through its speaker when you’re doing anything else? Like listening to music, videos, etc? Does your phone really not make a single sound apart from the audio in phone calls?
I wasn’t talking about some cheap $5 dongle, I specifically said quality headphones
headphone =/= dongle
The dongle is what you connect TO the headphone. Regardless, be more specific then. What’s the one you recommend? Should I buy $50 dongles then and keep them attached to my headphones? Since I use 4/5 of them does that mean that it’s ok in your opinion that I now need to spend $250 in dongles instead of just having a tiny, cheap, reliable jack on my $700 phone?
How much more specific do I need to be when I explicitly say “USB-C headphones”? What do you think USB-C stands for?
You could’ve done a single web search yo find that you can buy wired headphones that go straight into the USB-C port.No dongle required. But you’re too busy foaming from the mouth like a rabid dog to even understand what I said.
Well, you do need to be specific because like 99% of headphones terminate in a 3.5mm jack or a quarter inch jack. You were referring to a vert very limited subset of headphones.
It’s honestly kinda dumb to buy a headphone, which only needs an analogue voltage signal to work, that terminates in usb-c. Specially considering that there are still loads of devices that don’t have that port. Even if a computer has it, it’s likely that it only has 1 or 2 of them which might already be in use. For example, my work laptop has 2 usb-c and I’m using one of them to charge it and the other to connect a monitor.
For the amount of space a earphone jack takes it really doesn’t make sense for them to include it, when you can just use a cheap adaptor cable
“For the amount of space it takes to include a second speaker or second camera it doesn’t really make sense when you can just plug in an external one”
You sound like an idiot.
I can buy a phone from HMD that’s more repairable, more modular, and has sustainable features.
Fairphone has been a busted flush since they ditched the headphone jack. It’s just the most obvious sign amongst many they started making landfill phones.
Resorting to insults really?
3.5mm Aux takes up a shit load of space to connect 4 analog wires. If a phone has Aux it should at the very least be 2.5mm.
It makes no sense to me why you can’t just use an adapter.
More battery > Redundant analog cable most people don’t use anyway.
I might be a idiot as you say, but the people at Fairphone don’t seem to be because they ditched AUX as they should have
Having yet another thing to keep charged
a usb port is far easier to break
I hate earbuds, I want my same old over the ear $15 sony headphones that last for yearsBT is just another thing to fuss with for no apparent benefit, I have an assortment of BT crap that won’t connect consistently.
Whatever convenience BT might offer is negated by the time wasted learning the intricacies of the ever changing APPs [software]Still an idiot.
just make the phone larger and fill the empty space with battery
Honestly feels criminal with how bloated companies have made these phones yet they cheap out on a headphone jack.
Probably not a popular thing to say on here, but I think you’ve lost the battle for the earphone jack. It probably just requires way too much real estate to be practical on a modern day cell phone.
Exactly this, that’s a lot of space taken up to connect what 4 analog wires?
That’s insanity when a AUX to Usb-C converter does the job
USB-C requires a lot of space for charging, data transfer etc.
Let’s remove it too and make phones rely on wireless charging instead.
It absolutely does not require too much space. And you can still buy phones with headphone jacks, just not any of the (ironically) higher end models because OEMs know they can push their first party bluetooth headphones to these customers.
It absolutely does not. That’s just the stupid propaganda companies distribute to make people buy wireless earbuds.
Why does The Fairphone (Gen. 6) not have an audio jack?
After some of the criticism that we received about removing the headphone jack from Fairphone 4, we did consider bringing it back for The Fairphone (Gen. 6). However, we realized it would be at the expense of increasing the phone’s dimensions. We also looked into the consumer data and Fairphone 4’s weight and thickness were more of an issue than the lack of a minijack, so we decided to keep the same approach, although it was a difficult decision. We didn’t want to invest in OLED technology for the display and then not have improved the phone’s dimensions and weight. But just like with Fairphone 4 and Fairphone 5, we will still offer an adapter, which has had overall positive user reviews.
“We heard the criticism but decided that no, you would still need an adapter to use headphones, plus a USB-C hub to be able to charge the damn thing while listening to music or watching videos”
Funny how that’s the same excuses that we get for modern laptops terrible design. “We HAVE to make it thinner so there’s no space! You wouldn’t want a laptop that’s not complete shit if it meant it’d also be less thin and breakable, now would you?”
Very strange how mine can somehow fit a 7000mAh battery, dual SIM + SD card slot and a regular jack. Hmm…
Is it repairable only with a screwdriver and parts you can buy from the manufacturer?
That’s a definite advantage of the Fairphone.
I guess, I will find out how mine fares when the need arises. Hasn’t happened in 4.5 years yet.
Are you a Republican? Because that really sounds like “mine works, so fuck everyone else”
Are you a murican? Cuz you really sound like USA is your whole world.
Okay, I’m going to ask… why don’t you use wireless?
Edit: some results are in, and the only reasonable answer is better audio quality, although that’s probably no longer true. The rest are fairly weak reasons.
Lol’d at the 10m extension cord though, thanks for that one.
wireless headphones run out of battery, and most seem to have atrocious build quality and battery life.
The battery? Mine last at least 8 hours and charge in two.
Latency issue, in some use cases it’s not acceptable to have 0.1~0.3 sec lag, like racing games or rhythm games.
(Yeah, I know there are some wireless protocols to make latency shorter, but it might cost a lot to buy a supported headphone, and it’s still useless if the phone doesn’t have proper protocol supports.)
- They are expensive. You can get wired earphones for 2 euros that actually work and are reasonably durable. It’s not a great loss if they fall in a puddle or if I step on them.
- They are a lot more failure prone. Half of those I tried didn’t work or only half worked, and those that did work didn’t last very long.
- They have shitty range. I can use a 10 meters extension cord with wired earphones if I want to.
- They require charging. And it’s a law of physics that everything that requires charging always run out at the most inconvenient time.
- Also THEY ALWAYS GET LOST. Wireless earphones, mouse, controllers… it doesn’t matter, if it’s not attached with a cable they’ll just disappear.
1.Wired headphones deliver better audio quality 2.Wired headphones are harder to lose 3.Wired headphones don’t need batteries, so: a)less e-waste b)no need to check if they are charged 4.Wired headphones are more secure, connection cannot be intercepted and phishing attacks with BT are not possible 5.While wired headphones are plugged, no one can take your phone without you noticing
Let me give you simple example. When I take a flight, I like to watch my own media. Those flights sometimes are upwards of 10 hours. If I use wireless earbuds, both the earbuds and my phone will run out of battery and I have to charge them separately. However, since I have a phone with a headphone jack, my earbuds never run out of battery, I can charge my phone while I’m using them and I don’t need to use a single adapter.
Oh yeah, and the audio quality is also better.
It’s about options. You can still use Bluetooth even with a phone that has a 3.5mm jack. I also run live sound and have used the ability to plug my phone directly into the board for background music multiple times.
There’s a deGoogled version too!!
I would prefer GrapheneOS (If I can live with the irony of getting a Pixel phone just to deGoogle it…). Sandboxing there is way better. But you lose the Repairability… Gotta check and compare the new EU metrics too.
They are just two different devices.
I not only want a degoogled version but also a secure one. Sadly developing a secure android is rather hard. The Graphene team does it pretty well. Others try it too, but sadly they are not close.
Degoogled version is €50 more, for whatever reason
the reason: support for developers. You can install it yourself to save that amount.
People don’t want to pay for privacy. That’s the real problem with end users. Imagine if more people did so. What a world we could have. Nah. Let’s be cheap AF!
Locking privacy behind a paywall? Sounds like a nightmare.
That’s the real problem with end users.
The real problem with end users is that they buy according to whatever needs corpos inject via advertising.
Like Kagi for web searching.
Because the built in software is usually there because the manufacturer is receiving money from the software company. That’s why consumer devices are always bloated with garbage.
I bet PostmarketOS will release for it
GraphineOS is more secure
We know GrapheneOS only makes their OS on Pixel phones or whatever their own device will be so it’s moot
Thats because pixels fit the rigid standards, if Fairphone met them they would make a version for them
That would be great but that’s just not the way it is unfortunately
Is it really de-googled if it still runs Android?
the degoogled roms like eos calyx lineage graphene are not just aosp zero work roms with no gapps inclueded. the devs do work on changing as much google related code as they can even within aosp. nothing is perfect obviously, but im pretty sure there are compatible mobile linux distros even.
Just an update, I learnt that GrapheneOS developers are ‘aggressive’ towards other FLOSS projects (following comments on other thread, but you can searx grepheneos+controversy and see for yourselves).
So now, I might just prefer an FP6.
is the bootloader locked with eos?
It’s too bad they dont ship to Canada. I’m in the market for a new phone and would seriously consider this.
Clove Technology resells to outside the EU
But also consider potential carrier compatibility issues with importing
Thanks for the tip!
I had a look at the bands and it is indeed compatible in Canada! 🎉
Source: GSMArena + Fido support
Same US. EU gets the best stuff.
Fuck these guys… Seriously. I bought a phone off of them hyped at the idea of the ethics. It didn’t work on arrival. Over 3 months later and not one single reply to my helpdesk request (other than the Automated acknowledgement of receipt).
Unbelievably bad user experience, I went from hyped at the concept of reducing my production of electronic waste to beyond disappointed at a brutally bad user experience.
Then to make matters worse, it is difficult to source spare parts for the fairphone 4 (according to a friend of mine who owns one that he bought a while ago)… Like is that not the entire point of the phone, reduced consumption of new phones by supporting repairs. If you’re going to stop producing the spares at least release the patents then… if you really believe in the promoted ideals that you spout… Which they clearly do not.
It turns out that it’s just another money hungry company hell bent on burning the planet down to see a line go up, as far as I’m concerned. All gaff to sell shite phones at higher prices.
Do not buy.
The to make matters worse, they’ve already stopped producing spare parts for the fairphone 4
Your comment made me laugh! There’s no need to criticize the company if you’re having a bad day or don’t like it. It only takes a minute to check their website for spare parts. Most likely, it’s your local shop that’s out of stock, not Fairphone itself.
https://shop.fairphone.com/shop/category/spare-parts-4?category=4&filters=33
In terms of fp4 replacement parts, I am only quoting a friend of mine, I haven’t personally looked into that; though I was ready to believe it after my experience.
Then don’t spread information online that you don’t know to be true, Jesus Christ man.
It’s true, my language suggests I had researched that and found it to be true. When the truth is I just trusted my friends recount. I’ll edit my post.
I can’t ask anymore than someone to admit when they maybe didn’t take the right approach and I find that commendable. Thanks.
removed by mod
All I needed to know was when they released their BT earbuds just when the jack port got removed to figure out where their priorities are.
Of course they’re gonna offer BT earbuds if there’s no audio jack? Or did you want them included or something? A lot of people here are way angrier than justified.
Of course they are going to offer dongles too! The profit margins are way better on those. Fuck what the users want, we want money!
Louis Rossman on the topic: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bRdL0StldJM
Louis Rossman is a perfect example of someone who’s angry all the time.
And an attack on his character is of zero relevance to the topic of Fairphone and jack ports.
I would say having a headphone jack is better than not having one, but stop short of crying conspiracy. You would feel better if they didn’t sell BT earbuds?
I’m saying it is very hypocritical and goes against their brand. If they simply came out and said: Look guys making phones sustainably cost too much, we need to sell higher margin items like dongles, BT earbuds and cases to have enough cashflow to continue manufacturing and R&D.
Ok, fair enough. I would say.
But trying to justify and greenwashing the whole ordeal is insulting. The tactic is straight out of Apple’s “Think different” book. Paying more for reduced functionality. Only for them to sell you more accessories for even more money.
Is he wrong though?
No.
Two identical replies from two different accounts at the same time makes me think I’m responding to a bot, tho.
Just unfortunate timing I would think lol
Great minds think alike I guess.
Is he wrong though?
This is the vibe I’m getting from Lemmy lately just angry people shouting at clouds.
If it makes you feel better, I do that off of Lemmy, too.
Yep same here. Also they’re not capable of installing grapheneos which is kind of a deal breaker for me.
Isn’t that up to the GrapheneOS devs?
The GrapheneOS team makes their hardware security requirments very clear.
Its up to the hardware manufactures to include a few additional components used for securely storing keys, so far Google Pixles are the only consistent line of products that do so.
So… they chose to make a very Pixel-specific OS and you’re mad at Fairphone?
It’s not about being pixel specific. They built high security OS that uses HW components to deliver that high security. It can’t be delivered without them. These components are not google patented nor does GrapheneOS demands they use the exact pixel ones. GrapheneOS just refuses to lower security to support phones that lack these components, because manufacturers wanted to save maybe a $1 per phone by not including them at the expense of user security.
I think I had this all wrong. Fairphone isn’t / doesn’t want to be an enthusiast DIY brand at all (like framework for laptops) but a mainstream brand that’s eco-friendlier* and non-exploitative.
So of course they will not care much about niche features like other ROMs or audio jacks. The privacy focused, tech-savvy or feature focused buyers are not their target.
*IC and PCB related footprint is still roughly 80% of the FP4 and FP has little to no control on those processes, according to an independent study.
They are easily repairable and you don’t have to throw them away if the battery goes bad (just replace it).
How is that a bad thing? About 90% of other brands you can throw them away if the battery goes bad or they break.
How is that a bad thing?
I have to buy them? Every replaceable and repairable stuff is manufactured and has an impact.
About 90% of other brands you can throw them away if the battery goes bad or they break.
I don’t have any of those, for related reasons. The best one can do is to consume less and less often.
Buying a USB-C-2-Jack dongle or BT headset is anything but eco-friendly. It goes straight against the whole brand if you need to buy new stuff in addition to make it work.
What about people who already have a BT headset, or people who are looking to buy their first headset and don’t own one yet? You just straight up assume everyone still had a headset with wires lying around and that they somehow never break.
Having to buy something makes it bad isn’t really an argument. The very post you are making right now is made from a devide that has been manufactured at some point in time. If you start reasoning like that its better to start living in the woods with no possessions at all.
Before BT headsets even existed, all of them were wired and none of them required lithium batteries or chips inside.
Having to buy something makes it bad isn’t really an argument.
It costs resources to produce. It is one of the main missions of FP to reduce this by having to not by a new device if your current one breaks. If buying a new one wasn’t a problem, why are they trying to make it repairable?
They are easily repairable and you don’t have to throw them away if the battery goes bad (just replace it).
You get it.
If you start reasoning like that its better to start living in the woods with no possessions at all.
Taking my argument to the extreme naturally makes it absurd. But living in the woods isn’t my point.
If you look at FP’s yearly financial statements, you can see how they are struggling. In 2021 and 2022 they were roughly at a breakeven point, turning basically no profit, in 2023 their operating loss was 37% of their net turnover.
See previous comment:
I’m saying it is very hypocritical and goes against their brand. If they simply came out and said: Look guys making phones sustainably cost too much, we need to sell higher margin items like dongles, BT earbuds and cases to have enough cashflow to continue manufacturing and R&D.
Ok, fair enough. I would say.
But trying to justify and greenwashing the whole ordeal is insulting. The tactic is straight out of Apple’s “Think different” book. Paying more for reduced functionality. Only for them to sell you more accessories for even more money.
The to make matters worse, they’ve already stopped producing spare parts for the fairphone 4
What’s this then?
Hmmm that looks like parts listings for the Fairphone 4 to me, why do you ask ?
couse the other guy said that the parts are not manufactured anymore
Parts being available doesn’t necessarily mean they’re being manufactured. It just means there is unsold stock.
So they should overproduce just in case? All I care about as a consumer is that I can buy replacement parts.
they are beeing manufactored. The battery is avaible again at the end of june. That means that it got produced in the last months.
The to make matters worse, they’ve already stopped producing spare parts for the fairphone 4
philthi said this, LMAO!
In terms of fp4 replacement parts, I am only quoting a friend of mine, I haven’t personally looked into that; though I was ready to believe it after my experience.
What do you mean with stopped producing spare parts for FP4? They are still widely available
In terms of fp4 replacement parts, I am only quoting a friend of mine, I haven’t personally looked into that; though I was ready to believe it after my experience.
What are you talking about? I exchanged multiple mails per day when I had a problem.
Also as others have mentioned, the parts are still available on their website.
In terms of fp4 replacement parts, I am only quoting a friend of mine, I haven’t personally looked into that; though I was ready to believe it after my experience.
In terms of your good customer service experience… I mean, good? I’m glad your experience was better than mine? Mine has been the worst customer experience I’ve ever had with a company and I genuinely went in to this with a high opinion of them.
I don’t know what more to add here, we had different experiences, I’m sharing mine… You’re sharing yours? Different things are different to each other…
Your experience being different to mine doesn’t prove my experience never happened.
main camera, AI-powered low-light magic
Can I turn it off? Can I? I just want my photos, the real ones, however bad they are. I don’t want them to be half generated.
Just to be clear, unless you’re shooting RAW you never have your “real” photos. Every phone/camera performs massive amounts of post processing, including using ml models.
AI is only a buzzword for something that has been the norm for a while.
I want my photos to be grainy, with natural lens distortion, instead of current trend of pictures being shouty to look good on social media
You can shoot RAW on your phone today.
Only with primary lens
I think you need a camera, not a phone
I don’t need one, thanks
Oh, keep complaining then.
Maybe phones shouldn’t have multiple cameras if they aren’t actually usable
Maybe you shouldn’t buy a phone if you want a “usable” camera.
And you shouldn’t buy a camera either as you don’t seem to understand those either.
Is there any chance this is the same HDR technology that has been around for at least 10 years, but using latest marketing buzzwords?
Also, working a bit on developing my photos from RAW over last years taught me how we actually expect a lot of magic from a regular camera. The brain does a lot of work and low/high light compensation, color balance, etc… are required to some extend. Of course sometimes it becomes a bit absurd : most smartphone pictures seems oversaturated, with clear blue skies and I one took a photo of a blue-ish mountain because (I think) some classifier thought it was part of the sky.
Yeah, it’s most likely just doing some “AI” (ML) denoising. Nothing to do with GenAI
happy cake day!!
Thank you!
headphone jackn’t :(
Interesting that they seem to be using a consumer grade Snapdragon chip this time, typically they used weird chips ment for industry applications if I’m not mistaken. Wonder what sparked the change, did Qualcomm start supporting their chips for longer?
Probably yes.
And probably due to EU mandating new phones to be supported for longer.
https://energy-efficient-products.ec.europa.eu/product-list/smartphones-and-tablets_en
Looks like it.
Starting with Android smartphones running on the Snapdragon 8 Elite Mobile Platform, Qualcomm Technologies now offers device manufacturers the ability to provide support for up to eight consecutive years of Android software and security updates. Smartphones launching on new Snapdragon 8 and 7-series mobile platforms will also be eligible to receive this extended support.
They only used a weird chip for one generation (the last generation; 5)
They only did that once for the FP5. It was a terrible choice, leading to high battery usage and compatibility issues. They only did that because when it came out, 5 years of software support wasn’t something crazy any more. Samsung already provided the same on their mainstream flagship phones. So to top that they chose that embedded chip with 10 years of support from Qualcomm. But 10 years is practically speaking really hard overkill, especially considering the very impractical downsides of that chip.
By now, most major phone brands have support times rivalling what Fairphone is bringing to the table, and for that to work, Qualcomm has to support their mainstream phone chips for longer.
I just want them to make a true flagship phone. I personally wouldn’t mind paying extra for a more ethical phone, if it had all the bells and whistles and wasn’t half obsolete straight out of the box.
Snapdragon 7s Gen3 is a pretty decent chipset. Decent display too. 8GB RAM is a bit on the low side. Camera is all about how good processing is. It’s not that crazy expensive if all works well and considering what their goal is.
I’m on an S10e with only 6GB of RAM and it’s still running smoothly. If it was still getting security updates I would keep it for way longer, but alas it’s not so I’m going to upgrade to the new fairphone (not thrilled about losing the headphone jack and getting a larger phone, but I support their overall goals so it seems like the best choice for me)
I love the idea but the price is too high for the chip given that this is designed to be a longevity phone. A chip like the 7s Gen 3 would make the phone sluggish after a couple of years with how unoptimised todays apps are.
The Gorilla Glass 7i and IP55 water resistance are also concerning given that budget Samsung, Xiaomi, etc phones beat this.
However having components of the phone being easily replacable is a great thing.
FP would be a good choice for Graphene.
If they are all about swappable parts, and being able to upgrade your phone how you want … Shouldn’t this just be a module upgrade… Of the main part? Maybe I don’t understand it … At the very least the old parts should work with the new system right? Unless something major has changed.
Worth noting buying a second hand phone is still better in every aspect and sadly 2nd hand Samsung from 3 years ago is still better and cheaper. Though Fairphone is getting closer with each release!
I would totally buy one of these if they were sold in the US. Sadly, last time I checked the newest phone wasn’t sold here. So I doubt this one will be.
